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How to Detect Cheaters

@williamxp It is before in this thread #48 and #49, the numbers by lichess
https://lichess.org/blog/Y7C2yxAAAFBcUm6w/lichess-end-of-year-update-2022
This question is becoming a FAQ lately numbers should have a prominent place in the page to give answer to hot topics.
They are not full statistics and not much you can extract from those numbers but it is better than nothing.

@williamxp It is before in this thread #48 and #49, the numbers by lichess https://lichess.org/blog/Y7C2yxAAAFBcUm6w/lichess-end-of-year-update-2022 This question is becoming a FAQ lately numbers should have a prominent place in the page to give answer to hot topics. They are not full statistics and not much you can extract from those numbers but it is better than nothing.

@Artem-Kozirev said in #4:

In any case what I miss in the information from the link is how lichess performs in the view of a 3rd party auditor rather than how lichess views lichess ... For example the accounting books by lichess cannot be questioned because there is an external auditor which certifies they are absolutely truthful and is the result of applying legal accounting principles then it is crystal clear how lichess spends every cent, this is something lichess is compelled to do by law (and the law is there for some reason when it comes to money) it is not enough for the law that an institution shows accounting reports without verification.

As far as I know there is no third party institution that does this, every site has their own cheat detection methods, which are more or less private, and their own fair play rules and policies. The argument you have against Lichess values for every site out there.

The example about financial support and spending review being under law is only because Lichess has non profit status. Chess websites are private entities so they don't need to have an independent organ that checks them out constantly, they can share whatever they want and be perfectly fine with it without anyone disturbing them.
For all we know, chesscom numbers can be real like they can be fake.

Another example is when lichess, before granting the FM, IM, GM, etc. title before the user name requires proof to double check against FIDE, it is not enough that a user informs .... I am a GM elo 2754 ....

This is in the faqs: https://lichess.org/faq#titles. You should try to look better.

@Artem-Kozirev said in #4: > In any case what I miss in the information from the link is how lichess performs in the view of a 3rd party auditor rather than how lichess views lichess ... For example the accounting books by lichess cannot be questioned because there is an external auditor which certifies they are absolutely truthful and is the result of applying legal accounting principles then it is crystal clear how lichess spends every cent, this is something lichess is compelled to do by law (and the law is there for some reason when it comes to money) it is not enough for the law that an institution shows accounting reports without verification. As far as I know there is no third party institution that does this, every site has their own cheat detection methods, which are more or less private, and their own fair play rules and policies. The argument you have against Lichess values for every site out there. The example about financial support and spending review being under law is only because Lichess has non profit status. Chess websites are private entities so they don't need to have an independent organ that checks them out constantly, they can share whatever they want and be perfectly fine with it without anyone disturbing them. For all we know, chesscom numbers can be real like they can be fake. > Another example is when lichess, before granting the FM, IM, GM, etc. title before the user name requires proof to double check against FIDE, it is not enough that a user informs .... I am a GM elo 2754 .... This is in the faqs: https://lichess.org/faq#titles. You should try to look better.

I have not cheated and get marked as cheater. They did not changed it. The system what is used is not 100% waterprove. It is easy to say you cheater, but it has not to be as in my case. Good move and time as a computer. Sorry but I see things very quick. I move quick, it can and may not result into cheater.
They gave no game or something else what should be cheated.
So i am not guilty of using something, but marked as i do.
It is to strange for words that i have to prove i did nothing wrong as player. After that denied. I think it is not the right way how to handle. I got trouble to put it in English. Complains has to be in English.
So it is for me to hard and unfair. I am a playing with the unluck i am marked false.
I can laugh about it, i am a computer user in games , but i am not. So i play too strong and see to much.

I have not cheated and get marked as cheater. They did not changed it. The system what is used is not 100% waterprove. It is easy to say you cheater, but it has not to be as in my case. Good move and time as a computer. Sorry but I see things very quick. I move quick, it can and may not result into cheater. They gave no game or something else what should be cheated. So i am not guilty of using something, but marked as i do. It is to strange for words that i have to prove i did nothing wrong as player. After that denied. I think it is not the right way how to handle. I got trouble to put it in English. Complains has to be in English. So it is for me to hard and unfair. I am a playing with the unluck i am marked false. I can laugh about it, i am a computer user in games , but i am not. So i play too strong and see to much.

@Deadban said in #53:

As far as I know there is no third party institution that does this.

There are many institutions that do this, that is how the real world works. for serious websites. IT auditor is in fact a career at the University in many countries including France.

"every site has their own cheat detection methods, which are more or less private"

A site can have anything as long as it does not break the law, people must have the right of defence granted, right to a fair trial, etc. etc. otherwise the site is exposed to be taken to Court for wrong doing, this is a basic principle. Wait and see Niemann's case ... future CEO and shareholder of chessdotcom.

"and their own fair play rules and policies. The argument you have against Lichess values for every site out there."

Doing the same as everyone else is not the path to success in fact it is the opposite, every clumsy stinking pirate and lousy site out there are taking advantage of the many gaps in the regulations of cyberspace and many things which in real life are not allowed happen but it does not mean they are ethically correct, if at the first opportunity a site uses the existing gaps to step on people's right you as a user accept that ? is that ok with you ? you support that? To me Human's Rights first, not negotiable, you still want to do the same as the other sites out there when you have the chance to shape the future here and now?

Nobody and no site is above the law. Cyberspace does not mean you have the right to be above the law. The United Nations said that Human Rights are the same in cyberspace than in real life, the following link is quite explanatory https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_cyberspace I suggest you read it for your own benefit, real life is far more complex than writing a line of code, people tend to believe that if someone is good for writing code is good for everything and that is a mistake, that could be true only in very exceptional cases the world does not belong to computer programmers an AI writes code on demand today as much as they play chess.

The example about financial support and spending review being under law is only because Lichess has non profit status".
You are obviously not familiar with the regulations,the rule is by law a company and or charitable organization MUST have audited accounts, it is not a choice by lichess it is the law and it is not because its status of non profit, that is a general rule, which is true in most parts of the world unless you are talking about a very specific exception to this general rule in some specific country.

"Chess websites are private entities so they don't need to have an independent organ that checks them out constantly, they can share whatever they want and be perfectly fine with it without anyone disturbing them. "

Private entities or not they cannot be above the law and they are subject to the law, in particular Lichess abides by the laws in France. When information is shared the site acquires a high degree of transparence and avoids speculations of all kind, the opposite is described in the Trojan's war.People do not like a black box, that is the spirit of free code which lichess adheres to ... then what is the problem with sharing information about the data and be totally transparent, it is like wanting in a car some reliable and trustable information speedometer, tachometer and an the fuel level ... why not? what is wrong with that ? By the way someething relatively new is cyberattacks are also now recognized as Human Rights and it works in both ways when a site is under attack or when an individual is attacked by a site !

@Deadban said in #53: > As far as I know there is no third party institution that does this. There are many institutions that do this, that is how the real world works. for serious websites. IT auditor is in fact a career at the University in many countries including France. "every site has their own cheat detection methods, which are more or less private" A site can have anything as long as it does not break the law, people must have the right of defence granted, right to a fair trial, etc. etc. otherwise the site is exposed to be taken to Court for wrong doing, this is a basic principle. Wait and see Niemann's case ... future CEO and shareholder of chessdotcom. "and their own fair play rules and policies. The argument you have against Lichess values for every site out there." Doing the same as everyone else is not the path to success in fact it is the opposite, every clumsy stinking pirate and lousy site out there are taking advantage of the many gaps in the regulations of cyberspace and many things which in real life are not allowed happen but it does not mean they are ethically correct, if at the first opportunity a site uses the existing gaps to step on people's right you as a user accept that ? is that ok with you ? you support that? To me Human's Rights first, not negotiable, you still want to do the same as the other sites out there when you have the chance to shape the future here and now? Nobody and no site is above the law. Cyberspace does not mean you have the right to be above the law. The United Nations said that Human Rights are the same in cyberspace than in real life, the following link is quite explanatory https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_cyberspace I suggest you read it for your own benefit, real life is far more complex than writing a line of code, people tend to believe that if someone is good for writing code is good for everything and that is a mistake, that could be true only in very exceptional cases the world does not belong to computer programmers an AI writes code on demand today as much as they play chess. > > The example about financial support and spending review being under law is only because Lichess has non profit status". You are obviously not familiar with the regulations,the rule is by law a company and or charitable organization MUST have audited accounts, it is not a choice by lichess it is the law and it is not because its status of non profit, that is a general rule, which is true in most parts of the world unless you are talking about a very specific exception to this general rule in some specific country. "Chess websites are private entities so they don't need to have an independent organ that checks them out constantly, they can share whatever they want and be perfectly fine with it without anyone disturbing them. " Private entities or not they cannot be above the law and they are subject to the law, in particular Lichess abides by the laws in France. When information is shared the site acquires a high degree of transparence and avoids speculations of all kind, the opposite is described in the Trojan's war.People do not like a black box, that is the spirit of free code which lichess adheres to ... then what is the problem with sharing information about the data and be totally transparent, it is like wanting in a car some reliable and trustable information speedometer, tachometer and an the fuel level ... why not? what is wrong with that ? By the way someething relatively new is cyberattacks are also now recognized as Human Rights and it works in both ways when a site is under attack or when an individual is attacked by a site !

A site can have anything as long as it does not break the law, people must have the right of defence granted, right to a fair trial, etc. etc. otherwise the site is exposed to be taken to Court for wrong doing, this is a basic principle.

Yes exactly. That is why the Lichess terms of service provide details for players to start a court case.
The TOS of a respectable website is usually revised by lawyers. I think Lichess said in past that they ask for lawyers' expertise when they need to modify their tos. If what you can read is there it means they can legally do it.
You will more or less find the same steps in chesscom tos too.

> A site can have anything as long as it does not break the law, people must have the right of defence granted, right to a fair trial, etc. etc. otherwise the site is exposed to be taken to Court for wrong doing, this is a basic principle. Yes exactly. That is why the Lichess terms of service provide details for players to start a court case. The TOS of a respectable website is usually revised by lawyers. I think Lichess said in past that they ask for lawyers' expertise when they need to modify their tos. If what you can read is there it means they can legally do it. You will more or less find the same steps in chesscom tos too.

The site has a green dot when we log in and if it is constant, then the game green dot must match it's behaviour.

The site has a green dot when we log in and if it is constant, then the game green dot must match it's behaviour.

example, this is clear cheating, and you can make sure that , i reported him several times and his not banned yet

https://lichess.org/nkNTVFwt/black

example, this is clear cheating, and you can make sure that , i reported him several times and his not banned yet https://lichess.org/nkNTVFwt/black

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