Somebody explain all American political parties to me please

I don’t have much to add that others haven’t already, but I’d say your position is almost entirely a normal Democrat stance.
Republicans (that is to say, mostly MAGA right now) are mostly right-wing, but are different from Libertarians because they want more control over some things. Some libertarians want completely open borders and complete freedom of movement, so MAGA obviously does not stand for that.
Progressives usually differ from normal Democrats on Israel-Palestine and regulations.

I don’t have much to add that others haven’t already, but I’d say your position is almost entirely a normal Democrat stance. Republicans (that is to say, mostly MAGA right now) are mostly right-wing, but are different from Libertarians because they want more control over some things. Some libertarians want completely open borders and complete freedom of movement, so MAGA obviously does not stand for that. Progressives usually differ from normal Democrats on Israel-Palestine and regulations.

Decaffeinated

@greenteakitten said ^

I get that, but I'm also looking at what the political landscape would be around 2028, not necessarily the founding principles of a party that they may have strayed from now -- and besides just the two parties, is it even worth it to join a smaller third party in the first place since wouldn't one have like, even less choice since they'd be forced to vote between a Democrat and Republican eventually?

(1) Both the Republicans and Democrats are in crisis. Since 2016 definitely (and likely before), both parties have been experiencing a major split between the establishment and the populist right/left bases.

You could actually look at Occupy Wall Street and the Tea Party movement as the REAL first shots in this, and that was in 2011. I have a friend on the far left who wanted to build a coalition with the right wing populists in the Tea Party because he recognized something very important about how both parties had an 'anti-establishment wing.'

2028 will see this crises deepen more for the Left - the establishment is still firmly in control in the Democrats. The proof of this is the way that they were able to control their rhetoric around Israel and the fact that Biden and then Harris stayed on top in the 2020 and 2024 elections.

2028 will potentially cement MAGA as the new Republican establishment, basically meaning that the populist right wing will be in control of American conservatism. I think, arguably, that has already happened. Even if someone from the old Neocon days gets power, say a Ted Cruz, he is still not displeased to pander to the MAGA base.

You could say that even classic neoconservatives have become tepid MAGA supporters.

(2) Never be concerned about whether or not a Third Party will win. It won't in the current conditions. You join a third party because you are full of vim & vigor and really strongly believe in a set of principles that won't be compromised. It' like a calling for young people to experiment with this. And, my advice to every young person, if you don't want to be so political, go find a local subculture that is passionate about something like music, art, sports, cars, whatever, and go be weirdos with them without the politics because this is really how you get to taste life.

So... Even if you don't join... You should always network with Third Party people.

They are generally all intellectuals who know all the best people.

They deal specifically in IDEALS, right. So they are way into the philosophy and values at the base of a political system. They are grass roots. It's very romantic and passionate.

Even if you are a very normal, conventional person who just takes a very practical and moderate approach to politics, be aware that hanging out with Third Party-types is really awesome....

I think it is also the case that you will find older people in establishment parties were once 'third party' types, and so never worry too much about alienating yourself permanently...

We were all young, once!

@greenteakitten said [^](/forum/redirect/post/o1TZYtRM) > I get that, but I'm also looking at what the political landscape would be around 2028, not necessarily the founding principles of a party that they may have strayed from now -- and besides just the two parties, is it even worth it to join a smaller third party in the first place since wouldn't one have like, even less choice since they'd be forced to vote between a Democrat and Republican eventually? (1) Both the Republicans and Democrats are in crisis. Since 2016 definitely (and likely before), both parties have been experiencing a major split between the establishment and the populist right/left bases. You could actually look at Occupy Wall Street and the Tea Party movement as the REAL first shots in this, and that was in 2011. I have a friend on the far left who wanted to build a coalition with the right wing populists in the Tea Party because he recognized something very important about how both parties had an 'anti-establishment wing.' 2028 will see this crises deepen more for the Left - the establishment is still firmly in control in the Democrats. The proof of this is the way that they were able to control their rhetoric around Israel and the fact that Biden and then Harris stayed on top in the 2020 and 2024 elections. 2028 will potentially cement MAGA as the new Republican establishment, basically meaning that the populist right wing will be in control of American conservatism. I think, arguably, that has already happened. Even if someone from the old Neocon days gets power, say a Ted Cruz, he is still not displeased to pander to the MAGA base. You could say that even classic neoconservatives have become tepid MAGA supporters. (2) Never be concerned about whether or not a Third Party will win. It won't in the current conditions. You join a third party because you are full of vim & vigor and really strongly believe in a set of principles that won't be compromised. It' like a calling for young people to experiment with this. And, my advice to every young person, if you don't want to be so political, go find a local subculture that is passionate about something like music, art, sports, cars, whatever, and go be weirdos with them without the politics because this is really how you get to taste life. So... Even if you don't join... You should always network with Third Party people. They are generally all intellectuals who know all the best people. They deal specifically in IDEALS, right. So they are way into the philosophy and values at the base of a political system. They are grass roots. It's very romantic and passionate. Even if you are a very normal, conventional person who just takes a very practical and moderate approach to politics, be aware that hanging out with Third Party-types is really awesome.... I think it is also the case that you will find older people in establishment parties were once 'third party' types, and so never worry too much about alienating yourself permanently... We were all young, once!

salmon_rushdie

@Decaffeinated could you truly say that the establishment is in control of the dems? Bernie Sanders is far and the way the most popular active dem politician, followed by Mamdani and AOC. Bernie/AOC have been touring the country consistently drawing tens of thousands - while establishment dems do nothing. The momentum is solidly in their favor - and the 'centerist establishment dem' candidates, biden/harris/clinton have been shown over and over to lack the energy, momentum, message and charisma to make a strong showing in the current political environment. Progressive candidates destroyed much better funded establishment dems in primaries over and over.

tpr

"I understand Democrat and Republican"

Historically the Republicans were left and the Democrats were right, but it changed.
They are now central right Republicans and central left Democrats.
Some individual candidates are a bit less central.

"what are American Independent, Peace and Freedom, Green, Libertarian, etc.?"

Of no significance.

"I understand Democrat and Republican" * Historically the Republicans were left and the Democrats were right, but it changed. They are now central right Republicans and central left Democrats. Some individual candidates are a bit less central. "what are American Independent, Peace and Freedom, Green, Libertarian, etc.?" * Of no significance.

ed01106

@greenteakitten said ^

The reason I put myself as center right is because my views on LGBTQ+, crime, criminalization of recreational drugs, etc. (as well as personal views on other social issues) are very close to the far right, minus the whole hatred/discrimination part,

How can you have a far right position on LGBTQ+ "minus the whole hatred/discrimination part"?

If you view homosexuality as disgusting and something you personally would never participate in but feel homosexuals should have equal rights, that puts you in the left not the right. I personally am uncomfortable with homosexuality and declined both invitations I have received to attend gay weddings, because I would be uncomfortable at such an event. However, I support their right to get married so that puts me in "ally" camp.

That is a significant difference between the left and the right. Nobody on the left is trying to turn kids gay. (Despite what the trolls on Fox News claim). They just want to let the kids who are gay not be discriminated or hated.

Legalizing gay marriage had zero negative impact on heterosexual marriages.

Running on a platform of supporting equal rights for homosexuals is not the same thing as saying "vote for me because I am gay"

@greenteakitten said [^](/forum/redirect/post/o1TZYtRM) > The reason I put myself as center right is because my views on LGBTQ+, crime, criminalization of recreational drugs, etc. (as well as personal views on other social issues) are very close to the far right, minus the whole hatred/discrimination part, How can you have a far right position on LGBTQ+ "minus the whole hatred/discrimination part"? If you view homosexuality as disgusting and something you personally would never participate in but feel homosexuals should have equal rights, that puts you in the left not the right. I personally am uncomfortable with homosexuality and declined both invitations I have received to attend gay weddings, because I would be uncomfortable at such an event. However, I support their *right* to get married so that puts me in "ally" camp. That is a significant difference between the left and the right. Nobody on the left is trying to turn kids gay. (Despite what the trolls on Fox News claim). They just want to let the kids who are gay not be discriminated or hated. Legalizing gay marriage had zero negative impact on heterosexual marriages. Running on a platform of supporting equal rights for homosexuals is not the same thing as saying "vote for me because I am gay"

THE_IR0N_KNIGHT

don't forget the bull moose party

Firestar540

@ed01106 said ^

The reason I put myself as center right is because my views on LGBTQ+, crime, criminalization of recreational drugs, etc. (as well as personal views on other social issues) are very close to the far right, minus the whole hatred/discrimination part,

How can you have a far right position on LGBTQ+ "minus the whole hatred/discrimination pa...

I have no issue with the LGBTQ+ community, just throwing that out there.

@ed01106 said [^](/forum/redirect/post/YMsTRUBO) > > > The reason I put myself as center right is because my views on LGBTQ+, crime, criminalization of recreational drugs, etc. (as well as personal views on other social issues) are very close to the far right, minus the whole hatred/discrimination part, > > How can you have a far right position on LGBTQ+ "minus the whole hatred/discrimination pa... I have no issue with the LGBTQ+ community, just throwing that out there.

Dukedog

Really other than the Republican and Democrat partys
Most the others go home with a participation ribbon,
Maybe a good idea to check out their mission statements to see how they see themselves.

I've voted for Green candidate a few times,i Knew they couldn't win... actually after a search they do win locally but never federally ..
Tbh sometimes i vote for them to avoid supporting other parties plus ya know ig they are good hearted people trying to benefit us all.
Lol,big red and big blue
Lol, there's and old saying
"TRUST ME"

MY recent experience with local ads in Arizona,its absolutely desitute. Everything is emotional and manipulation with no one addressing the issues
and rhetoric fallen aside and facts not checked

Buzz words and jingoism and people don't even realize they're being manipulated.

My party triuh to be told
Is
Cynic

Can ya'll get behind that?
Hey,man,
over to the side
Not directly behind me
What the heck ,?

Are you a politician?
Whats going on here anyways?

Move along folks..
Nothing to see here...

Really other than the Republican and Democrat partys Most the others go home with a participation ribbon, Maybe a good idea to check out their mission statements to see how they see themselves. I've voted for Green candidate a few times,i Knew they couldn't win... actually after a search they do win locally but never federally .. Tbh sometimes i vote for them to avoid supporting other parties plus ya know ig they are good hearted people trying to benefit us all. Lol,big red and big blue Lol, there's and old saying "TRUST ME" MY recent experience with local ads in Arizona,its absolutely desitute. Everything is emotional and manipulation with no one addressing the issues and rhetoric fallen aside and facts not checked Buzz words and jingoism and people don't even realize they're being manipulated. My party triuh to be told Is Cynic Can ya'll get behind that? Hey,man, over to the side Not directly behind me What the heck ,? Are you a politician? Whats going on here anyways? Move along folks.. Nothing to see here...

Decaffeinated

@salmon_rushdie said ^

@Decaffeinated could you truly say that the establishment is in control of the dems? Bernie Sanders is far and the way the most popular active dem politician, followed by Mamdani and AOC. Bernie/AOC have been touring the country consistently drawing tens of thousands - while establishment dems do nothing. The momentum is solidly in their favor - and the 'centerist establishment dem' candidates, bi...

Isn't the proof that Sanders did not get the nomination, and that after him Biden then Harris were the nominees, while the GOP was running the very hardcore Donald Trump..?

I would also point out that AOC has really walked back her positions on Israel and has seen to be incredibly disappointing in that regard. Even Ilhan Omar has done this to some degree - I read her policy position when I was voting for Trump a second time in 2024 because I wanted to see just how dedicated she was to Palestine, and it was remarkably moderate. Probably because she also represents St. Louis Park, MN, the Jewish quarter of the Twin Cities (Mayor Frey is of MPLS is Jewish, actually). Nonetheless, it's hard to imagine anyone adequately representing the left in a robust way that is a Zionist.

But hey, the left wing is your thing. I will not stand in your way of saying the establishment is adequately left. Your beliefs are for you to define. I just observe.

@salmon_rushdie said [^](/forum/redirect/post/qw9LCtZC) > @Decaffeinated could you truly say that the establishment is in control of the dems? Bernie Sanders is far and the way the most popular active dem politician, followed by Mamdani and AOC. Bernie/AOC have been touring the country consistently drawing tens of thousands - while establishment dems do nothing. The momentum is solidly in their favor - and the 'centerist establishment dem' candidates, bi... Isn't the proof that Sanders did not get the nomination, and that after him Biden then Harris were the nominees, while the GOP was running the very hardcore Donald Trump..? I would also point out that AOC has really walked back her positions on Israel and has seen to be incredibly disappointing in that regard. Even Ilhan Omar has done this to some degree - I read her policy position when I was voting for Trump a second time in 2024 because I wanted to see just how dedicated she was to Palestine, and it was remarkably moderate. Probably because she also represents St. Louis Park, MN, the Jewish quarter of the Twin Cities (Mayor Frey is of MPLS is Jewish, actually). Nonetheless, it's hard to imagine anyone adequately representing the left in a robust way that is a Zionist. But hey, the left wing is your thing. I will not stand in your way of saying the establishment is adequately left. Your beliefs are for you to define. I just observe.

salmon_rushdie

@Decaffeinated said ^

Isn't the proof that Sanders did not get the nomination, and that after him Biden then Harris were the nominees, while the GOP was running the very hardcore Donald Trump..?

2024 is/was very different than now - the debacle of that whole primary/election cycle cost establishment dems a lot of credibility - specifically the same dems that have ran the last 3 unpopular candidates, and the last 2 years have seen them look weak compared to progressive leaders, just look at the senate minority leader - Schumer - he's been incredibly weak. Every year sees the old guard weaken and the voting base power shift to a younger generation.

@Decaffeinated said [^](/forum/redirect/post/LkW7jk1D) > Isn't the proof that Sanders did not get the nomination, and that after him Biden then Harris were the nominees, while the GOP was running the very hardcore Donald Trump..? 2024 is/was very different than now - the debacle of that whole primary/election cycle cost establishment dems a lot of credibility - specifically the same dems that have ran the last 3 unpopular candidates, and the last 2 years have seen them look weak compared to progressive leaders, just look at the senate minority leader - Schumer - he's been incredibly weak. Every year sees the old guard weaken and the voting base power shift to a younger generation.