VASAviation - Radio Audio of Air Canada Plane Crash with Fire Truck at LaGuardia

ATC was understaffed and unpaid due to the recent funding shutdown.

You can draw your own conclusions
As to who was ultimately to blame

ATCs are paid by the FAA, which is part of the Department of Transportation, and it's not affected by the current DHS shutdown.

ATC is pretty much always understaffed at many airports, and they are using ridiculously outdated technology. This is nothing new. Republicans are not doing anything about it, and neither are Democrats.

@Toadofsky -- I know about your article -- and I hope everybody sees what is going on. I try hard to see clearly, myself, by staying on top of the news as best I can, by attending to a lot of legitimate sources and trying to take into account their apparent political biases, if any.

This failure to pay has been going on FOR WEEKS -- FOR MORE THAN A MONTH. Please stop and think about that.

I hope EVERYBODY stops and thinks about that and doesn't miss the point.

The Democrats' NEW attempt, apparently to only pay one PART of Homeland Security would retain the unfairness of NOT paying ALL of Homeland security, I believe.

Do you really think it's fair for the Democrats -- now that the public is getting SICK of this political nonsense -- to be able to shift pressure from themselves by agreeing (finally) to pay SOME of the people working and STILL NOT PAY THE OTHERS?

Please read carefully what YOU YOURSELF just typed or copied in your immediately preceding post. I'll copy and paste it here, so you know what I mean:

QUOTE: "The measure does not include funding for Immigration and Customs Enforcement or Border Patrol,..."

That seems to me like a kidnapper FINALLY agreeing to give back SOME of the kidnapped children -- but not all of them -- in order to make themselves look not quite so bad, while they keep trying to force others to give them what they want. That's a metaphor (or, technically, a simile, I suppose) by the way, in case some get confused -- I'm not ACTUALLY calling anybody a "kidnapper."

Politicians should NOT use NOT PAYING people who ARE working -- ESPECIALLY in important, necessary jobs -- as leverage for ANYTHING. And the fact that some politicians will FINALLY agree to start paying SOME of the people should not be confused with cause for nominating those politicians for sainthood.

The WEEKS of NOT PAYING hard working, important employees should STOP ENTIRELY -- not just partially. This does not seem to me a reasonable and fair way for politicians to try to force through their own ideas.

Nations NEED customs enforcement and border patrol ALSO. ESPECIALLY in time of war, for goodness' sakes. Which politician really thinks it's okay to not pay customs officials and the border patrol?

NOBODY should be forced to work without pay as a mere bargaining chip for politicians to get what they want.

Is that really a controversial contention? Does that really need to be rebutted by anybody?

And notice -- it's NOT the Trump administration itself who is doing that. I hope the New York Times notices all this clearly, too.

Media needs to keep everything in context and perspective and NOT be partisan and help one side or the other muddy the waters. I hope all media agrees. We need carefully nonpartisan, objective media more than we need most other things.

@Forgistador -- indeed, ATC has needed a lot of love for a long, long time.

And thank goodness the FAA IS still being funded, unlike Homeland Security, or the airports might have to close entirely, I think. Controllers can still eat, at least, even if they don't always have the most modern equipment.

Unfortunately, many crucial employees working "in airports" don't work for the FAA. And reportedly some have been forced to sell their blood or even their cars so as not to miss rent payments. And this has been going on for WEEKS.

I wonder why the MASSIVE spending on "infrastructure" during Biden's administration apparently didn't also MASSIVELY speed along modernization efforts in ATC which have long been planned and discussed. Air Traffic Control COULD use a "lot of love" equipment and systems wise -- and I hope that will be on the way. Even though I've been sad to see the phase-out of many VORs over the years -- but perhaps nostalgia and over-caution influence my sentiments.

I even still hate to see an NDB disappear, admittedly!

Your point is a good one. But I retain my profound unease when politicians play politics in a way that causes even SOME of the crucial airport employees -- and OTHER national security employees --to go unpaid for their work.

Thank goodness they aren't holding up pay for the FAA, also. But let's not give anybody any ideas.

@Noflaps said ^

POLITICIANS play politics

Whats new?

Do you see the point?

Nope, you lost me.

We don't need TSA and the Coast Guard and the Secret Service and others to GO WITHOUT PAY.

That IS quite unnecessary.

Right...

What's the point of typing the words "what's new," @End_Game_Flame ?

Is it that "politicians" play games so we can just shrug and think that's "just the way it is."

I hope not -- you DO, thankfully, and I believe wisely, seem to agree that the Coast Guard and Secret Service should be paid. I hope that you agree that Border Patrol and Customs employees need to be paid, too.

Here are some of MY points, phrased still differently, since you write that I have "lost" you.

Not ALL politicians have kept crucial employees from being paid for WEEKS on end. Not all politicians are the same.

ALL government workers who are actually working NEED TO BE PAID. Not just SOME of them.

I don't see how this should be the least bit controversial. I see NO excuse for using working people as a bargaining chip. EVER. And not EVERY politician does that.

So far as I can tell, the Trump Administration itself is NOT doing that. To the contrary. Indeed, it's been reported that Trump is now trying to break the silly deadlock, and get people paid, via executive order - although I'm not sure that that will fly -- it's up to Congress to get working employee salaries funded, I believe.

I hope all people -- instead of just shrugging and moving on -- will notice WHICH politicians are voting and acting so as to get ALL of the government workers paid and which politicians are NOT doing that. It's a pretty clear, obvious distinction between ALL and SOME. And I think it's an important distinction.

It's not hard to find out who is clinging to not paying ALL of them, and I don't think it should just be ignored. NOT ALL politicians are willing to let SOME important government employees work without pay, in order to "negotiate" and get what the politicians want (or for any other reason).

And that's a crucial, important difference between politicians, isn't it? I can't just shrug and act like it isn't.

I truly appreciate your voicing agreement about Coast Guard and Secret Service. Thank you.

And I hope you agree with me, or in time will come to agree with me if you don't, now, about the rest, too. But, of course, you are fully entitled to your own opinion, as I readily will acknowledge.

I certainly believe that you and all other readers have the right to make up your own minds. I can only state my own opinions, and hope for the best, relying upon the reader's own maturity, experience and intelligence to evaluate those opinions.

Perhaps somebody else will find some way to defend not paying important government workers for their work. But, for now, I just don't see that it's at all justifiable.

I think we agree on more than you realize, @Noflaps.

What's the point of typing the words "what's new,"

I was pointing out that all politicians have been the same and (likely) always will be.

Is it that "politicians" play games so we can just shrug and think that's "just the way it is."
I hope not

No, in the US, we can change that, if we try. if we do simply give up, they get away with it.

you DO, thankfully, and I believe wisely, seem to agree that the Coast Guard and Secret Service should be paid. I hope that you agree that Border Patrol and Customs employees need to be paid, too.

Of course! If someone does you a job, they get paid, its simple economics.

Here are some of MY points, phrased still differently, since you write that I have "lost" you.

Not ALL politicians have kept crucial employees from being paid for WEEKS on end. Not all politicians are the same.

I was not aware that they are not being paid, excuse my ignorance.

ALL government workers who are actually working NEED TO BE PAID. Not just SOME of them.

I don't see how this should be the least bit controversial. I see NO excuse for using working people as a bargaining chip. EVER.

Of course, people using people for their own ends is why the Constitution was written in the first place.

So far as I can tell, the Trump Administration itself is NOT doing that. To the contrary. Indeed, it's been reported that Trump is now trying to break the silly deadlock, and get people paid, via executive order - although I'm not sure that that will fly -- it's up to Congress to get working employee salaries funded, I believe.

I hope all people -- instead of just shrugging and moving on -- will notice WHICH politicians are voting and acting so as to get ALL of the government workers paid and which politicians are NOT doing that. It's a pretty clear, obvious distinction between ALL and SOME. And I think it's an important distinction.

It is the duty of American Citizens to be informed voters. It is also a privilege that should not be shunned.

I certainly believe that you and all other readers have the right to make up your own minds. I can only state my own opinions, and hope for the best, relying upon the reader's own maturity, experience and intelligence to evaluate those opinions.

I thank you for not trying to force your opinion on other people, as do so many people nowadays, and merely pointing out what you think and leaving it up to us.

And I thank YOU, @End_Game_Flame , for your willingness to read, consider, remain objective and respond politely. Your last post was among the most refreshing and optimism inspiring that I've read in quite a while.

As I've admitted more than once, and sincerely, I can be wrong -- and I've been wrong before, as I'm well aware.

But right now, I'm concerned with the political games being played as the American midterms draw nearer. Too many politicians are blowing hot air, and we really don't need any more global warming.

Every person who shows up to work needs to be paid and not used as a bargaining chip. And I'm happy when others agree with that. I'm only concerned that too many people will not notice, or refuse to notice, who is actually refusing to get ALL of the workers paid.

For some, it's not politically convenient to notice which politicians are NOT willing to pay ALL of the government employees who are actually, and selflessly, continuing to work.

It's not the Trump administration that is refusing to fund. It has been some in Congress for many weeks now. The latest game playing shouldn't make us forget the last several weeks, I think.

Again, I will start with where we agree. Perhaps you have read my earlier posts suggesting that the budget problems started with last year's budget which guaranteed $75,000,000,000.00 for ICE enforcement and did not guarantee anything for anyone else.

@Noflaps said ^

NOBODY should be forced to work without pay as a mere bargaining chip for politicians to get what they want.

I agree, and yet last year's budget bill causes the current crisis, like any austerity spending legislation in any nation always causes crises of this form. And today I share with you news of the U.S. Senate approving budget bill H.R. 7147 "Consolidated Appropriations Act, 2026" which immediately funds those who aren't being paid today, in exchange for Trump's ICE no longer being funded to murder and terrorize America. Surely you support H.R. 7147?

@Toadofsky said ^

@Noflaps said ^

NOBODY should be forced to work without pay as a mere bargaining chip for politicians to get what they want.

I agree, and yet last year's budget bill causes the current crisis, like any austerity spending legislation in any nation always causes crises of this form. And today I share with you news of the U.S. Senate approving budget bill H.R. 7147 "Consolidated Appropriations Act, 2026" which immediately funds those who aren't being paid today, in exchange for Trump's ICE no longer being funded to murder and terrorize America. Surely you support H.R. 7147?

Do you know that not only TDS is existing, there is also the RTDS. Why are you expecting someone dealing with RTDS to not cherry pick bills according to his-her Political Bias ?

Someone dealing with Reverse Trump Derangement Syndrome, will blame anyone but Donald Jennifer when his actions are a failure and will give credit only to Donald Jennifer when what he did is successful.

Good luck trying to obtain indirectly what you failed to obtain directly. Cherry picking is in the DNA of those struggling with RTDS.

@notsoneutral said ^

Do you know that not only TDS is existing, there is also the RTDS. Why are you expecting someone dealing with RTDS to not cherry pick bills according to his-her Political Bias ?

Someone dealing with Reverse Trump Derangement Syndrome, will blame anyone but Donald Jennifer when his actions are a failure and will give credit only to Donald Jennifer when what he did is successful.

Good luck trying to obtain indirectly what you failed to obtain directly. Cherry picking is in the DNA of those struggling with RTDS.

Yeah... the internet can be the wild west. One possible way to think about this is: I deal with people in real life who are equally unreasonable, so it's interesting to learn what kind of arguments are more effective than others. I guess I can imagine this as debate preparation for having to deal with unreasonable people.