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if christian god existed, would he be a cruel god?

@Scroto_Baggins said in #150:

Mental gymnastics. There's no debating somebody who doesn't believe in evidence and proof. I can never win because you will always fall back on your faith without any attempt to refute any of the facts that I've presented you with, or any regard for the truth.

Enjoy your "ultimate truth". To me it is the ultimate delusion.
It's not mental gymnastics. I'm not trying to avoid or jump around anything. I feel as though I'm being pretty direct.

And yes, you are right! That's the point I've been trying to make. Faith and Science are inherently separate things! God's existence can be neither proven nor disproven through science.

And I'm not sure why you're trying to "win" anything? This is a discussion, not a game of chess. I'm not trying to have a formal debate here, either lol.

And of course I would not make an attempt to refute anything - I believe in science, but I believe in that SEPARATELY from my faith. They are incompatible systems of thinking - at least unless science were to advance much, much further and prove or disprove the existence of some kind of "spirit"!

@Scroto_Baggins said in #150: > Mental gymnastics. There's no debating somebody who doesn't believe in evidence and proof. I can never win because you will always fall back on your faith without any attempt to refute any of the facts that I've presented you with, or any regard for the truth. > > Enjoy your "ultimate truth". To me it is the ultimate delusion. It's not mental gymnastics. I'm not trying to avoid or jump around anything. I feel as though I'm being pretty direct. And yes, you are right! That's the point I've been trying to make. Faith and Science are inherently separate things! God's existence can be neither proven nor disproven through science. And I'm not sure why you're trying to "win" anything? This is a discussion, not a game of chess. I'm not trying to have a formal debate here, either lol. And of course I would not make an attempt to refute anything - I believe in science, but I believe in that SEPARATELY from my faith. They are incompatible systems of thinking - at least unless science were to advance much, much further and prove or disprove the existence of some kind of "spirit"!

They are not incompatible. They are both attempts at explaining something that none of us can understand. It's just that some provide better explanations than others.

To refute your points one by one:

It is mental gymnastics. If you proclaim yourself to be a logical thinker, than how can you ignore/refute logic?

You are avoiding and jumping around every point that I have made.

Faith and science are not inherently different, because they both try to answer the same questions.

Of course I can't disprove God's existence, but you also can't disprove that there's a giant spaghetti monster in the middle of the universe that made everything and IS God. To debate about disproval of something is worthless, to debate about acceptance of something's existence actually matters.

I'm trying to win because you are trying to debate with Sleepy_Gary and you are just so obviously wrong I can't resist but stepping in to show you the flaws in your logic.

I am trying to have a formal debate here.

You clearly don't believe in science well enough if you are "On the fence" about earth being 6,000 years old.

They are not incompatible, they in fact refute one another.

You cannot disprove somethings existence. No matter how far science advances, it will not be able to disprove my Spaghetti Monster or your God. Yet it can certainly give us a preponderance of the evidence, and that has already been clearly proven.

Enjoy Heaven.

They are not incompatible. They are both attempts at explaining something that none of us can understand. It's just that some provide better explanations than others. To refute your points one by one: It is mental gymnastics. If you proclaim yourself to be a logical thinker, than how can you ignore/refute logic? You are avoiding and jumping around every point that I have made. Faith and science are not inherently different, because they both try to answer the same questions. Of course I can't disprove God's existence, but you also can't disprove that there's a giant spaghetti monster in the middle of the universe that made everything and IS God. To debate about disproval of something is worthless, to debate about acceptance of something's existence actually matters. I'm trying to win because you are trying to debate with Sleepy_Gary and you are just so obviously wrong I can't resist but stepping in to show you the flaws in your logic. I am trying to have a formal debate here. You clearly don't believe in science well enough if you are "On the fence" about earth being 6,000 years old. They are not incompatible, they in fact refute one another. You cannot disprove somethings existence. No matter how far science advances, it will not be able to disprove my Spaghetti Monster or your God. Yet it can certainly give us a preponderance of the evidence, and that has already been clearly proven. Enjoy Heaven.

Sorry I was offline for some time, now I shall do my entrance.

The thing already reached 16 pages lol

Sorry I was offline for some time, now I shall do my entrance. The thing already reached 16 pages lol

About the "If God exists, why is there evil in the world?", there is a very simple answer to it;
The reason there is evil in this world is because, people don't turn back to God and don't rely on him and don't seek guidance from him.
That's why there are people who do misguidance. Because they want life pleasures more than reward in الآخرة. Because people listen to Satan and consider him an ally.

"If God exists, why is there evil in the world?" is not a good question, and is already adressed. https://quran.com/2?startingVerse=30 . God knows better than anyone and anything else.

About the "If God exists, why is there evil in the world?", there is a very simple answer to it; The reason there is evil in this world is because, people don't turn back to God and don't rely on him and don't seek guidance from him. That's why there are people who do misguidance. Because they want life pleasures more than reward in الآخرة. Because people listen to Satan and consider him an ally. "If God exists, why is there evil in the world?" is not a good question, and is already adressed. https://quran.com/2?startingVerse=30 . God knows better than anyone and anything else.

And about Christianity, I critique it because it's illogical.
The bible is inauthentic. There are manuscripts that are different than other manuscripts. It contains some truth, but a lot of falsehood (it disrespects the prophets of God).
The trinity is illogical. Either it's three, or one.
God doesn't become a human (because God is All-powerful and doesn't need food, but humans are not all-powerful and eat food).

And about Christianity, I critique it because it's illogical. The bible is inauthentic. There are manuscripts that are different than other manuscripts. It contains some truth, but a lot of falsehood (it disrespects the prophets of God). The trinity is illogical. Either it's three, or one. God doesn't become a human (because God is All-powerful and doesn't need food, but humans are not all-powerful and eat food).

It's a crazy and bad book intended to enslave people all so called religious books are.The God of the new testament is the same as the God(Alla) as in that book.
All religion calls for killing or enslaving others.

It's a crazy and bad book intended to enslave people all so called religious books are.The God of the new testament is the same as the God(Alla) as in that book. All religion calls for killing or enslaving others.

@Sleepy_Gary said in #125:

Lets keep running around in circles then: God is all knowing and all powerful, so he created them knowing they would introduce sin (what you claim is the cause of natural disasters and starvation that kill people every day). So he allowed it to happen, so he's a cruel POS.
no he gave them free will ️

@Sleepy_Gary said in #125: > Lets keep running around in circles then: God is all knowing and all powerful, so he created them knowing they would introduce sin (what you claim is the cause of natural disasters and starvation that kill people every day). So he allowed it to happen, so he's a cruel POS. no he gave them free will ️

@thefrickouttaherelol said in #151:

It's not mental gymnastics. I'm not trying to avoid or jump around anything. I feel as though I'm being pretty direct.

And yes, you are right! That's the point I've been trying to make. Faith and Science are inherently separate things! God's existence can be neither proven nor disproven through science.

And I'm not sure why you're trying to "win" anything? This is a discussion, not a game of chess. I'm not trying to have a formal debate here, either lol.

And of course I would not make an attempt to refute anything - I believe in science, but I believe in that SEPARATELY from my faith. They are incompatible systems of thinking - at least unless science were to advance much, much further and prove or disprove the existence of some kind of "spirit"!

Faith and science are separate when faith stays in its lane of dealing with things that can’t be proven. However, there are many cases where faith attempts to explain things that CAN be proven, and have been proven already.

I’m glad you believe in evolution, but there’s a large population of people that are pushing biblical explanations of the universe in school. They think it’s okay to teach your children that the scientific method is false, and that the process of proving things correct - which is a cornerstone of every technology that is responsible for the modern world - is worthless when you have the Bible and a rapist preacher to indoctrinate you.

Listen to yourself. You’re attempting to move the goal posts, “ maybe god meant 14 billion years when he said 6000”. You’re shitting all over the very foundation that allowed your job in technology to be created in the first place.

What’s the danger in this? Science solves the problems of humanity, and this process involves questioning our universe. Diverting human intellect into pointless avenues of study - I.e. anything faith based - directly undermines our drive to continue to explore.

I recommend you read the book Abusing Science by Phillip Kitcher if you want a thorough philosophical explanation of the dangers of religion. Or, you know, look at human history and the countless religious wars and suffering that’s resulted from your “immovable faith”

@thefrickouttaherelol said in #151: > It's not mental gymnastics. I'm not trying to avoid or jump around anything. I feel as though I'm being pretty direct. > > And yes, you are right! That's the point I've been trying to make. Faith and Science are inherently separate things! God's existence can be neither proven nor disproven through science. > > And I'm not sure why you're trying to "win" anything? This is a discussion, not a game of chess. I'm not trying to have a formal debate here, either lol. > > And of course I would not make an attempt to refute anything - I believe in science, but I believe in that SEPARATELY from my faith. They are incompatible systems of thinking - at least unless science were to advance much, much further and prove or disprove the existence of some kind of "spirit"! Faith and science are separate when faith stays in its lane of dealing with things that can’t be proven. However, there are many cases where faith attempts to explain things that CAN be proven, and have been proven already. I’m glad you believe in evolution, but there’s a large population of people that are pushing biblical explanations of the universe in school. They think it’s okay to teach your children that the scientific method is false, and that the process of proving things correct - which is a cornerstone of every technology that is responsible for the modern world - is worthless when you have the Bible and a rapist preacher to indoctrinate you. Listen to yourself. You’re attempting to move the goal posts, “ maybe god meant 14 billion years when he said 6000”. You’re shitting all over the very foundation that allowed your job in technology to be created in the first place. What’s the danger in this? Science solves the problems of humanity, and this process involves questioning our universe. Diverting human intellect into pointless avenues of study - I.e. anything faith based - directly undermines our drive to continue to explore. I recommend you read the book Abusing Science by Phillip Kitcher if you want a thorough philosophical explanation of the dangers of religion. Or, you know, look at human history and the countless religious wars and suffering that’s resulted from your “immovable faith”

@cubester1232 said in #157:

no he gave them free will ️

He chose to create a universe where immeasurable suffering happens everyday. He’s a cruel POS

@cubester1232 said in #157: > no he gave them free will ️ He chose to create a universe where immeasurable suffering happens everyday. He’s a cruel POS

@cubester1232 said in #157:

no he gave them free will ️

Do you believe that slavery is okay? If so, you’re a cruel POS just like the Christian god. If you don’t, then you’re not following the Bible, and you’re applying your own ethics to god’s word, and you’re a hypocrite. Which one is it?

@cubester1232 said in #157: > no he gave them free will ️ Do you believe that slavery is okay? If so, you’re a cruel POS just like the Christian god. If you don’t, then you’re not following the Bible, and you’re applying your own ethics to god’s word, and you’re a hypocrite. Which one is it?

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